What's the characteristics you'd like to see Inna Dealer other than :

Knowledgeable
Answers the phone
Parts availability
Honest
?
?
?
?
?
etc

fj

When the telemarketers call... and I have time and feel like it...

I tell them I ONLY do business with folks I can literally look in the eyes.

Once in a while, someone asks why? I reply: Then I can bring the cops and put your @$$ in jail if you try to cheat me.

Most of them just hang up... grin.

Thanx, gents - MORE IDEAS ANYBODY ?

fj

OK, I was kidding above...

After running a small business for 35 years, selling to consumers (not business to business), I find that customer service is #1!!!
Listen to the customer, explain to them what you can do for them... then (and this is the MOST important):

DELIVER!

Happy customers spread the word... just one p*ssed customer... well they seem to get ALL the attention... Just one of those things.

Now if I was the buyer... I would be looking for the same thing I just said a seller needs to do.

Having said this... it is not easy to find someone that delivers these qualities.

Under promise and over produce.

Almost all of my stair business is word of mouth.

You must do what you say.

Very fast replies back to the customer. You are working for them.

News of your good work will travel, but it travels slow.

Sloppy , slow, or any other bad news travels fast.

Stan

.
Be careful Jim ... being a dealer (of any product) is often not as glamorous or profitable as it seems at first.

Even a good dealer ends up dealing with customers who are "less than good" sometimes .... and if things go wrong ... guess who gets blamed ??

Most manufacturers insulate themselves from their customers by using their "dealers" as the firewall .... try calling GM if your truck is a lemon .... it will never happen .... they send you to your local dealer who could even be a friend .... your dealer didn't build the truck but he has to take the brunt of the flack

Most manufactures will give you demands you may find uncomfortable .... maybe want money from you up front (in order to be a dealer) .... several units on display or in stock ..... parts stock and inventory .... compulsory advertising ...... compulsory attendance at air shows around the country ....POOF !!!! ... there goes 200 grand before you even sell one.

Jim .... I have absolutely no idea about any plans you may have .... just be careful .... you seem to be the kind of person who has all the attributes of being a good and honest dealer .... you would never be the problem .... real life and real business hassles (everything else except you) is where the snags are.

On the other hand being a dealer can be very rewarding and fulfilling if it is something you enjoy doing .... makes you a profit ... and helps pay for your own "fun"

Thanxs !!!!

The 'Goal'. would be to bring a great product to the Market place, and to fund our passion !

The biggest doubt I have is that I would not be able to be civil to a customer who asked for the Moon ! (And expected to GET it. )

Not very close to making any 'leaps, just trying to analyze the concept ! You guys seem to be all 'Good' guys, and I really appreciate your input !!!

How would the gyro community respond to the Dealer SHIPPED requested parts within 2 days ? Seems to me that concept is kinda missing in the Sport.

Howabout complete Kit DELIVERY. In 2 weeks ?

And the biggest question to me would be - IS IT A QUALITY PRODUCT ??

THANK YOU AGAIN for your inputs !

fj

FJ- If the Helicycle kit could be shipped in one shipment....even if it took 6 months.....they would be overwhelmed with orders and would have to expand their work force.

Knowing that you have to first get in the pipeline of the 40 customer run....then wait over 2 years after that....if you are lucky....my wait was 2.5 years.........this probably kills most orders.

Its only for my sheer determination of finally finding a helicopter that satisfied my desire for flying a helicopter....that I happily committed to this wait. It was worth it...but I am very patient when it comes to getting something I really want.

Stan

Hi Bro

Gabor and others have added most of the general aspects I would Add just meet your customers needs... some are more needy than others and that is where temperament will help.

The realities of a gyroplane dealership from 3 years experience:

At first I did not know all the answers, and still don't. I always honestly admit I do not know and tell them let me contact Nicolas I need to know this too and I let you know.

So far everyone seems happy.

Now this gyroplane dealership has cost me about 60K and growing. Rotorcraft is a much smaller market than FW so all dealers sell few aircraft even if your territory is the entire USA.

With the current market at the rate I'm selling models it will take 10 to 20 years to pay for just the demo models investment back... And that's if I have no other expenses, like traveling to fly-in's and normally business operating expenses.

At this rate my expenses will always be more than income so it will not probably be for profit, maybe ever....

What it does offer, if you are going to buy the toys anyway and go to the fly-in's anyway, is a tax deduction against your Farm income at the same percentage of state and federal income tax that you are paying now.

So if you are paying a combined state and federal tax rate of 35% of your income then your dealership losses will save you 35%.

If we only analyze the 60K for demo models that = 21K savings in taxes that you are paying to your passion instead of the government. Still do not make money here just trading your pocket for the governments purse?

This of course mean's you are still paying for 65% yourself or 39K the majority of it out of your own pocket.

Only because it's a passion and not a business in the since of earning a living does this make any business since to become a dealer in such a small market, with more models available than in our lifetimes. It's a great thing for customers! Business would rather be a monopoly like Mircosoft or Benson?

Benson knew how to market!! Only by copying his basic program of advertizing this new CHEAP toy and providing everything they need, even if back then it was a self training program.
He found a way to meet his customers needs!

I'm working on CREATING a new market in California, without non-powered rotor instruction for over 10 years.

My attempt at Benson marketing:
PRA 31 and I are creating Rotorland, it's a place where families can fly and train year round while spending about the same money as they do now for an off-road or personal watercraft camping weekend by sharing expenses as co-owners. With pilots taking turns for lessons and flights of all 3 co-owned gyroplanes and we have FWs too.

Now to grow the market we can ADVERTIZE the CHEAPEST way to get any pilot's license! And hopefully flip them to gyroplanes as that what they stated learning in.
You now travel to all events you love to go to anyway, and charge part of it off. You fly and land or just trailer it to events with a sign Learn to Fly at events with large crowds like Baja 500, the Thunder boat races in mission bay etc. You follow Benson example of showing up at all the local TV and radio stations with your toy and at least trying to get permission to land when no room to take off.... = Just copy Benson!

Once you have an FBO with training and rentals you may be able to really grow the market. However the line I sell currently will not fit all of my customers needs so I will probably add lines as I discover what this new market will demand.

It's taken a few years to find all the catch 22's to make this legal while protecting members liability and write all the contracts = hold-harmless, LLC's, co-ownership etc required. But now it's all available as a presentation so you would only have to copy and change as required to suite your needs...

John/ALL_IN

That was/is an excellent post... you explained well what it means to set up a business that probably will never produce a serious profit.
IMO if one is interested in a dealership... they should re-read the post a few times.

In the heating and AC and refrigeration business... lots of young techs come up the ranks, who are really GOOD at what they do... that is: the skill of doing the repairs, installations, and even bidding/sales. HOWEVER:
Running a business is a whole different skill than doing the work.
If I have explained this once, I have explained it a hundred time: Get an education in running a business BEFORE you go out on your own.
And guess what: They do not listen... they go out on their own... and they go broke.
The failure rate on new small businesses over the first 2 years of operation is between 80-90%, depending on the strength of the economy. Why? Because the new guy does not know how to run a business.

Now I suspect Jim and Chris DO know how to run a business... they are successful in agriculture... which is not an easy business to even eek out a subsistence living. That they can afford a hobby like gyro's, says a lot!

Here is my $0.02 worth: If you really want to do this... get a SCORE coach (contact the local branch of the small business administration). SCORE coaches are retired successful business-folk, they 'coach' folks to learn how to succeed.
You and your SCORE coach define what you want to do, then write a business plan. Part of this business plan is a marketing plan; and forecast goals... which you WILL hit. NOT if, maybe, hope, pray... you WILL make this happen. (Note: IMO, if one is not willing to set goals and MAKE them happen... they probably should think twice before investing in a small business... unless the purpose is a write off or a hobby that is a write off.)
Then bring that business plan to BD's at the end of March... and us folks who run businesses will sit down with you (in private), and help you think this out.
The more planning you do, the better chance you have of succeeding.

Personal comment: I have thought about this many a time: There is a need for gyro parts. Yes, parts. Someone who has the ability to ship all kinds of parts to whom-ever orders them (some would have to be sourced as they were ordered, and some would have to be made in the shop), could service what I believe is a HUGE market. Note Greg Mills may be trying to do this with his Mohawk Aero venture.... For Greg's sake, I hope he is successful.

If you want to discuss this more... I will be glad to share my thoughts... as other Wolverines will also. And yes... I will keep this quiet.

Best to you Jim... we are all behind you, whatever you choose to do.

John/GA

WOW !

I couldn't ask for better feedback ! Thank you, Thank you !

I will re-read all these posts, (just got in from a challenge-ing day working with sm as IDIOT BRICKS, (hay bales) and Really appreciate the thots expressed !). and will re-evaluate our 'mission' !

Life is truly an adventure !

The more I learn, the MORE I realize how ignorant I am !

Thanx again !

fj

Just my humble $0.02 worth...

If we can keep that perspective (bold and large type)... we can have a GREAT time!

just ask who they voted for! A liberal will bankrupt you because they believe the gov should dictate how you do things.

Customer service is key.
Ernie Boyette misses this.
He wants to tell the customers what he wants to deliver. Doesn't work.
I could tell you some stories of many lost sales for him but........

Now if you are dealing pot, which is the next big money maker in the Ag industry,
the sky is the limit!

I am not gonna ask Jim if he is doing this... it is none of my business... However:

If we see him at BD's 2015 with a couple of new European built gyro's... well...

Just kidding...

.

Hey fj .... if these guys offer you a dealership ...

Just say NO !!!! hehe

I see the owner himself (eXoGyro008 post # 55 + 56 ) has joined the forum to "straighten us out" ..... should be fun.

http://www.rotaryforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37326

I see Kai has deleted all his previous posts in that thread .... I wonder if he was threatened with a lawsuit ???

Sound familiar ??

Kai is around here once in a while .... maybe he can fill in the details for us

Good information from all.
I have heard that the best way to make a small fortune in Aviation, is to start with a BIG one....

As far as 2 day shipping, I would think that would be great until you would have to start stocking large amounts of inventory to anticipate sales, And then getting those items from your suppliers in a timely manor may be out of your hands. I have never been a dealer.

I think that it would be more profitable to grow medical marijuana on your hay farm and sell aircraft as a hobby.. That would be my plan.

GEEZ, LOOKS LIKE NOW YALL ARE GNNA SEND ME BROWNIE RECEIPES ?! .


I'm simply exploring avenues I MIGHT pursue since we've pretty much gotten away from grain production. (40 yrs worth). Still doing hay &.beef.

Am Thankful for all yer posts, - and let me say this - I have learned SO much from dealing with 'The Buttrfly LLC - That is why I am seeking yall's input !

Do you think that the Butterfly LLC would buy back the product they sold me for what I've spent on it ?

Dream on, me-thinks !

More comments thots ENCOURAGED,

fj

One thing I should point out! If you already own a business you can already charge off your experimental aircraft and gyroplanes.

Solely copy what Nas Car sponsors do and slap your logo or company name on it and you can LEGALLY charge off (deduct from you business profit) MILLIONS in advertizing.

Deprecating the cost (purchase price) of it over 5 to 7 years and add in traveling expenses to fly it to advertize your business at public events.

So you do not need to lose money to find a catch 22 on this one!
----
Pot you only have a few years to get rich if the trend of earning taxes instead of paying 400 mil a year to house those arrested now for pot laws. Voters are finally starting to figure it out!

Have we won one day in the war against drugs?

Facts: the price of drugs from 1960 to date has gone down or stayed about the same currently which means = Same or more supply in the USA = we are not stopping anything with this law.
We only make it profitable to support crime making then rich beyond compare and we are responsible for over 10,000 drug murders just in Mexico each year!

This is sooo immoral of the US! Think about it: Valentine's Day Massacre with only 7 bootleggers killed in one day and the US repeals the laws that cause the killing and it's stopped!

I love to use logic and ask friends who believe that the drug laws are stopping anything. One question and one bet to prove my case.

1) If the current drug laws cannot keep illegal drugs out of armed, guarded, supervised, prisoners jailed hands with wire and huge walls to keep them in and drugs out, how can you possible believe that laws will ever keep them out of a FREE USA unless we have a guard assigned to each person?

2) I'll bet ANYONE. That if we pick any city in the USA, that has a drug clinic in it and that we BOTH do not know anyone and never been to before.

I can buy any drug I want on the streets 24/7 solely because it is illegal and you try and buy regulated alcohol = AFTER hours when it not available illegally!

Who do you think will win that bet when drugs are only made profitable solely because they are illegal and the seller is at risk of going to jail or paying a fine.

Regulated alcohol is much harder to get when you do not know where to go to buy it and the bars and stores close now isn't it?

The way to make a fortune fast by growing pot is to share-crop 100 plant farms in CA and least then the land splitting WS/selling price with them. Fill out the paper work and it's legal in CA but the Fed could come in a still bust the share cropper. One acquaintance made 300K last year alone and it was only his 1st year trying it.

Once the US farmers start growing pot the price will come down as it's a weed to grow. = Supply and demand. The only real change to world society is the crime from the black market will famish overnight as it did with the bootleggers right after prohibition laws on alcohol.