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RayNAiken
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:24 pm Posts: 2747 Location: East Central South Carolina
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Why not pull collective, get out of all the turbulence, go around and set up to land again?
_________________ ===RayNAiken===
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Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:22 pm |
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Hillberg
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:56 am Posts: 3074 Location: VERY LOW LOW LOW EARTH ORBIT
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It was an overhead shot by news 10 helicopter I just waited for the posted video to end and hit a random 'next' video in the mix. It scrolled down the flight line etching the tarmac and cement apron till it flipped over. Like an angry child with chalk on the street.
Last edited by Hillberg on Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:25 pm |
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Hillberg
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:56 am Posts: 3074 Location: VERY LOW LOW LOW EARTH ORBIT
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RayNAiken wrote: Why not pull collective, get out of all the turbulence, go around and set up to land again? The A 350 is a wallowing pos to hover close to the ground it doesn't need turbulence , lower than 3 feet and the pig wallows in it's own down wash a high pressure bubble escapes out at random directions causing all sorts of fun for the pilot the trick is to not dick around and just land it straight away from your high hover then you'll look like a pro.
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Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:29 pm |
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RayNAiken
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:24 pm Posts: 2747 Location: East Central South Carolina
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Another thing I noticed is it didn't appear to me the engine was whining down. I'm guessing it was still at flying rpm for several minutes until it self destructed.
_________________ ===RayNAiken===
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Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:45 pm |
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Hillberg
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Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:16 pm |
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MadMuz
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_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:07 am |
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RotoPlane
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:18 pm Posts: 420 Location: Gilboa, OH
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ScaryGary wrote: Very sad . Something was going very wrong in that hover prior to touchdown .
I agree. There were too many retries to gain control after touching the gear. Something was not right with the ship......or that was the worst piloting I have ever seen.....
_________________ Ed Rosenberger
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Tue Nov 24, 2015 10:51 pm |
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GordonT
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 2:25 pm Posts: 1260 Location: Central Florida
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Preliminary NTSB Report http://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/brief.aspx?ev_id=20151118X05037&key=1 NTSB Identification: WPR16FA029 14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation Accident occurred Wednesday, November 18, 2015 in Carlsbad, CA Aircraft: AIRBUS HELICOPTERS AS350B3E, registration: N711BE Injuries: 2 Fatal.
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed. NTSB investigators either traveled in support of this investigation or conducted a significant amount of investigative work without any travel, and used data obtained from various sources to prepare this aircraft accident report. On November 18, 2015, about 1624 Pacific standard time, an Airbus Helicopters AS350B3E, N711BE, departed controlled flight while landing on a moveable helipad at Mc Clellan-Palomar Airport, Carlsbad, California. The pilot, who was the owner, was operating the helicopter under the provisions of 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 91. The private pilot and private pilot-rated passenger were fatally injured; the helicopter sustained substantial damage. The local personal flight departed Carlsbad at 1411. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed, and no flight plan had been filed.
The entire accident sequence was captured on airport security cameras and the mobile phone cameras of multiple witnesses.
The helicopter departed earlier in the day from the east end of the Premier Jet fixed base operator (FBO) ramp, which was located midfield on the south side of runway 6/24. After departure, line crew moved the helipad to the west end of the ramp.
Upon returning, the helicopter approached the airport from the northeast and was cleared to land on runway 24. It descended to midfield, turned left, and approached the ramp in a low hover via taxiway A3. The helicopter then followed taxiway A and began an approach to the helipad from the east and into the direction of the sun. The helicopter then landed short of the helipad, with the center of its skids making contact with the pad's front edge. The helicopter immediately rocked back and its tailskid struck the ground. The helicopter then began a series of back and forth oscillations, and the helipad broke free from the rear left chock, rotated to the right, and pivoted around its front right wheel. The helicopter spun with the helipad for the first quarter of the turn, and then rapidly climbed and rotated 270 degrees to the right. The helipad came to rest to the north, having revolved 180 degrees, and about 50 seconds later the helicopter landed on the tarmac east of the helipad, while partially straddling taxiway A and the ramp at a 45-degree angle.
For the next 2 1/2 minutes line crew re-secured the helipad, installing chocks on three of the four wheels. The helicopter then repositioned for an approach to the helipad from the west. During the next 4 1/2 minutes the helicopter made three landing attempts, getting to within 5 to 20 ft of the helipad. A video of the final landing attempt was captured by a witness, who was located about 130 ft south. He had observed the other landing attempts and was concerned that the helicopter may crash, so positioned himself behind a car at the corner of the FBO's hangar.
The video revealed that the helicopter again landed short of the pad, similar to the first landing attempt, rocking back and forth twice onto its tailskid. After the final strike, the helicopter pitched violently forward and out of view behind the hangar. Security cameras revealed that from here the helicopter spun 180 degrees to the left, and after reaching a 45-degree nose up attitude, the aft tailrotor and vertical stabilizer assembly struck the ground and separated. The helicopter bounced and rotated another 360 degrees before landing hard on its left side. Once on the ground, the main rotor blades and cabin continued to spin with the engine still running. The helicopter continued spinning for the next 5 minutes and 10 seconds while slowly sliding about 530 ft east along the ramp. The tailboom and horizontal stabilizer then separated and the helicopter rolled onto its side, shedding the main rotor blades. The engine continued operating for another 30 seconds while fire crew doused the helicopter. White smoke billowed from the engine's exhaust after the helicopter came to rest, but there was no indication of fire.
The pilot purchased the helicopter on October 29, 2015, but had flown demonstration and familiarization flights in it since September 20. According to the helicopter's maintenance records, those flights totaled about 8.8 hours, and were all conducted with a certified flight instructor present. He received an additional 2 hours of flight training on November 13.
According to friends and flight instructors who had flown with the pilot, he had previously owned a Bell 407, and the accident flight was the first he had flown in the AS350 series without a professional pilot present.
_________________ “If things go wrong, don't go with them.” ..... ― Roger Babson “People say there are thousands of options we have in life. I say we have only two: we can either be happy or be unhappy.” ..... ― Pawan Mishra
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Tue Dec 01, 2015 1:17 pm |
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Hillberg
Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 12:56 am Posts: 3074 Location: VERY LOW LOW LOW EARTH ORBIT
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DUMB ASS 1pilot had 8.8 hours in type I bet he twisted that collective into a square knot.
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Tue Dec 01, 2015 1:30 pm |
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MadMuz
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I never saw a dolly he was trying to land on? Anyway, it is a shame once he had landed it the first time, that he didn't just leave it on the ground and ask his instructor to park it on the dolly. Surely parking on the dolly wasn't THAT important? What amazes me tho, is how many rich people buy gadgets and don't always understand them.... but they are rich, so they can do what they want.... but sometimes it costs them everything.... Being wealthy may not be good for ones health? When I watched the videos, I didn't see he was trying to land on anything.... I thought he was just trying to land and went into some sort of overcontrolling very similar to a gyro PIO.... but a helicopter version back and forward on the spot. I wonder what killed them both? Maybe whiplash? Do civilian helicopter operators normally wear helmets? If yes, maybe the weight of the helmets broke necks? If no.... maybe they banged heads together? Condolences to their families and friends none the less.... sad
_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:36 am |
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RotoPlane
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:18 pm Posts: 420 Location: Gilboa, OH
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Here is another AS350 type rotorhead that is reacting in a similar fashion during touchdown.....it didn't hit a tree limb. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7a2_1450927506
_________________ Ed Rosenberger
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Fri Dec 25, 2015 12:29 am |
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MadMuz
Site Admin
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_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Fri Dec 25, 2015 8:02 am |
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Gabor
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ouchy.....
_________________A walk in the woods helps me relax and release tension. The fact that I am dragging a body should be entirely irrelevant! A simple thank you would have been enough for the morning coffee without all that "how did you get in here" nonsense.
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Fri Dec 25, 2015 9:01 am |
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RotoPlane
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:18 pm Posts: 420 Location: Gilboa, OH
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MadMuz wrote: Did it go around and land safely?
No.....it crashed.....but all people in and around were okay.
_________________ Ed Rosenberger
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Fri Dec 25, 2015 6:14 pm |
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MadMuz
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RotoPlane wrote: No.....it crashed.....but all people in and around were okay.
So, what would have caused it to pitch forward so violently? I would have thought the pilot would be just stabilizing it then shut it down? It was square on the pad on the ground, then it nearly tumbled forward like the cyclic had been shoved forward? I can see how windy and exposed the pad is.... but was that pilot error? The wind? Turbulance from the trees? What ACTUALLY caused that accident? Or what combination of things?
_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Sat Dec 26, 2015 5:37 am |
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Gabor
Site Admin
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_________________A walk in the woods helps me relax and release tension. The fact that I am dragging a body should be entirely irrelevant! A simple thank you would have been enough for the morning coffee without all that "how did you get in here" nonsense.
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Sat Dec 26, 2015 10:13 am |
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MadMuz
Site Admin
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:45 am Posts: 10129 Location: Poona, Qld, OZZY
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_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Sat Dec 26, 2015 10:45 am |
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Gabor
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Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 2:18 pm Posts: 11382
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_________________A walk in the woods helps me relax and release tension. The fact that I am dragging a body should be entirely irrelevant! A simple thank you would have been enough for the morning coffee without all that "how did you get in here" nonsense.
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Sat Dec 26, 2015 1:24 pm |
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RayNAiken
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:24 pm Posts: 2747 Location: East Central South Carolina
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MadMuz wrote: RotoPlane wrote: No.....it crashed.....but all people in and around were okay.
So, what would have caused it to pitch forward so violently? I would have thought the pilot would be just stabilizing it then shut it down? It was square on the pad on the ground, then it nearly tumbled forward like the cyclic had been shoved forward? I can see how windy and exposed the pad is.... but was that pilot error? The wind? Turbulance from the trees? What ACTUALLY caused that accident? Or what combination of things? I can tell you of an experience we had at ROC in Aiken one year. A helicopter had it's ass end into the wind when he lifted. Evidently he did not have enough tail rotor authority and it did the same thing in that video. The pilot blamed it on the crowd and the airport invited us to hold the ROC event elsewhere. The ROC event is now the Wrens event.
_________________ ===RayNAiken===
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Sat Dec 26, 2015 2:01 pm |
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MadMuz
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Gabor wrote: Talking about SAVING IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
What the hell was that? Who was actually supposed to be flying that? The guy with his leg out the door or the other guy with his leg out the door?? I thought the cyclic did the controlling, I didn't realise you had to keep a heli level with your legs out the door Which is the actual pilot's seat in a chopper Is it the left chair or does it depend on which direction the rotor turns? That video was creepy how it was slowly going backwards in circles.... I didn't think it was 'out of control' tho..... just neither of them seemed to be controlling it.... nor even attempting to? (unless you think trying to hold it up with your leg is controlling it)
_________________ I do all of my own stunts..... most of them are even planned! Ok, Ok.... some of them are planned..
If electricity comes from ELECTRONS, then surely morality comes from MORONS??
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Sun Dec 27, 2015 12:15 am |
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