A fatal blade separation of an R44 blade which killed 2 people in New Zealand has grounded R44s in Australia. Condolences to the loved ones of those lost....
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-02-21/p ... el/6180406
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| R44s grounded in Australia http://skywolverines.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2185 |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Sat Feb 21, 2015 10:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | R44s grounded in Australia |
A fatal blade separation of an R44 blade which killed 2 people in New Zealand has grounded R44s in Australia. Condolences to the loved ones of those lost.... http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-02-21/p ... el/6180406 |
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| Author: | Arnie M. [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
. One of the very first R22's suffered a blade delamination circa 1979 ... Frank blamed it on poor quality control by an "outside blade supplier" .... so they began building their own blades "in house" ... yet problems continued .... even after several "new blade designs" during the past 36 years Too bad they could not simply wrap the skin completely around the spar instead of the 3-piece way they do it now .... there is only a narrow bonding surface ... half an inch wide I think ... and if there is an occlusion in the adhesive , or moisture gets under the joint it will delaminate The next solution from the factory was to get 8000 worldwide pilots tapping 8000 american quarters on 16,000 blades before they go flying  .... listen for the "hollow spots" they said Frank designed a very light rotor blade ..... and one thing that enabled him to do that was by incorporating "coning hinges" in the rotor head which relieve bending stress on the root of the blade .... pretty clever .... but I think that has him cornered ... he cannot build a better (heavier) blade without building a beefier rotor head to handle the weight (of a heavier blade) If somebody came up with an aftermarket certified blade there is a hell of a big market out there ... maybe a composite ???? .... could it be made light enough ??? I hope Hillberg chimes in here ... he knows lots ... . |
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| Author: | Arnie M. [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
 . Do not use Canadian money Do not use Australian money Make sure to only use the Factory approved Robinson Blade Safety Kit Before each flight lightly tap all adhesive joints on both blades , upper and lower surfaces Coins not included in this factory directive Step ladder not included either . |
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| Author: | Animal [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 12:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
man doesn't anyone beleive it flush rivits anymore? something as critcal as a Rotor blade, I want as strongly put together as possable. |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
They should get Ernie to design and build their blades  I think carbon fiber is the answer... they would be lighter than what they have now (except 4 times the price)   Maybe not, the quantity needed might make for cheaper prices  
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| Author: | GyroGeorgia [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 7:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
IMO who-ever manages to develop and market carbon fiber rotorcraft blades... Is gonna make a fortune! IMO it is a product who's time is close... I wish I had the ability to do the R&D and get it into production. |
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
Damn stainless skins peen as they erode not like the aluminum skinned blades, That causes the skin to peel right off the spar.... An after market blade would kill Kerts* monopoly on control of the Robbie fleet . But the R-44 will pylon whirl when a blade delaminates RIP... note:* Franks retired. A cup with composet roavings and a foam core will do the trick (and a shit load of dollars) 
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| Author: | Arnie M. [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
. Not sure if this is related .... 26 Jan 2015 Airworthy Notice .... New Zealand .... large crack on trailing edge of rotor blade P/N C016-7 .... has good pictures .... PDF http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j ... 5890,d.dGc . |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
That one was about .42355353665777 of a second off being a complete catastrophe Arnie  I would hazard a guess that the next takeoff would have been the last I doubt that would have been all done in one go.... maybe it happened from the preflight until the machine started vibrating there is an extreme possibility, in my mind, that the crack had been there for some time on the trailing edge, even just one skin..... what I take away from this is that when you preflight or daily any rotorcraft..... pay attention to your rotors.... don't just look to see they are there.... actually look, run your finger down the trailing edges with your fingers in 'crack find mode' ...... stand back, look if they droop correctly..... if a leading or trailing edge seems to change direction slightly, instead of being a nice constant curve..... if it looks wrong... investigate..... don't leave it til later, later might be too late Off the subject of the R44 blade in question, people have been posting about transporting gyros with rotors on, something I would only do if I lived next door to the airport, and even then I would prolly whip them off, just in case.... and you will prolly have read my comments..... taking off and keeping the rotors safe in a box or tube is a no brainer if it hails or someone runs up the back of your trailer.... but also, prolly more importantly, it gives you a chance to really look at your rotors, both sides (all the bonding) and both edges..... plus you can really eyeball the hub bar and straps as well as the teeter block for witness marks of movement..... and of course, the teeter bolt. It also gives you the opportunity to spin the rotorhead and listen for smooth operation, lift the head up and down feeling/listening for play and also to grease and turn cotton reels or bushes..... grab the components of the prerotator, look for cracks or anything wrong with your top rod ends, tall tail top braces etc.... all the stuff you cant take a close look at if you are just standing on the ground. Your rotors are your life..... whilst they stay in one piece and connected to the machine, you can at least do some sort of controlled landing.... if a blade (or half a blade) falls off it is highly unlikely you will survive..... Turning up at a venue with your gyro on a trailer after a 500 mile road trip with the rotors on and supported, even supported very well, I doubt many people will climb up and inspect real closely anything topside.... especially if others are already flying and you cant wait to fly too..... Like I said at the start, I am sure there would have been evidence of that blade failing well before the last flight..... it may not have been there at the daily, but if subsequent flights that day that crack could have crept quite quickly..... at least before every flight after your daily, don't just cast an eye over the rotors..... actually spend a minute or 2 and actually look  See that outer end section has been leading and lagging on the flex of the spar/leading edge so much, that in lag it has buckled the trailing edge on the outer section (red circle in pic) that pilot is sooooooooooo lucky 
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| Author: | Gabor [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Author: | Arnie M. [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
. Looks surprisingly similar to the 2012 blade failure on the R22 that went down in the ocean at Tampa Bay Florida http://tbo.com/news/man-killed-in-helic ... lot-578735 . |
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| Author: | loftus [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
That does suck - Des Butts posted about some carbon fiber gyro blades he is testing on his Facebook. |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 9:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
I reckon carbon fiber blades would be so light..... you would definitely need tip weights (big ones) 
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
The one in Florida was a bad coning bolt that snapped off the hub, lost both blades at once, Took a year to get all the pieces, That crack in the top R-44 pix is 5 hours old. . .Seen lots of cracks through the years more than Muzzy?.
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 1:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
Yeah, you sure have.... I have only seen one cracked hub bar, well, the pitch adjusting block, much the same as what FJ found on the first set of rotors for his machine, only the chunk fell away before he noticed..... and 2 different sets of Jack Allen blades come unglued at the trailing edge, right where the droop started to happen, like, the stationary blade had some coning angle upwards, then, right where the blade was bending most, the trailing edge was open about 1/32" for about 4" of the trailing edge.... the bonding agents weren't as good back in the 90's. I saw it on 2 different sets of rotors, both insisted on tying the rotors down HARD, forward and aft, where most of us just lasso'd the front blade and loosely tied just the front.... one guy tho, old fella.... used to bring his machine religiously to flyins, he had about a 4 page check list which he had on a clip board and went over the entire machine and always found something wrong to ground him..... as far as I know, no one ever saw him fly.... ever..... the other guy was just rough on every part of his machine.... the rotors separated and just rested in the back of his pickup, with the blades resting on the sharp edge of the tray and hanging over, when he went around corners, the rotors slid from side to side just an idiot..... that's it for me and cracks.... now crack ho's.... that is a different story  
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
Steve had a gyro out here , He asked me to look at a set of tip blocks . I told him he had 3 hours before they would come off,,,, He didn't think so.......3 flight hours later we saw him dive into a farmers field full of tumble weeds 4 to 6 ft tall. Yep he said the stick shook so bad he thought the rotors were flying away.... Yep 3 hours. Did the same for Hiser. . .He'ed shit every time I'ed tell him when the part was going to take a dump. Same with my brother with LASD They couldn't believe his predictions and were scared that he was right 100% of the time. . . The machines do talk, You just have to listen and feel them.
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| Author: | Arnie M. [ Tue Feb 24, 2015 9:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
. Now they lifted the ban on R44 flights ... they said the latest cracked blade was caused by impact damage https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stori ... licopters/ . |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
I would still pass on a 'joy flight' in any robinson until they get their blades replaced 
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
Just received an AD to inspect the blades trailing edge before each flight (Duh) Bet they didn't round or relief the trailing scarf at the tab edges, Nice sharp skin corners so classy
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| Author: | Dropbear [ Sat Feb 28, 2015 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: R44s grounded in Australia |
GyroGeorgia wrote: IMO who-ever manages to develop and market carbon fiber rotorcraft blades... Is gonna make a fortune! IMO it is a product who's time is close... I wish I had the ability to do the R&D and get it into production. NEWS FLASH  Carbon fiber rotors ARE HERE ... at least in OZ ... as an integral part of THE NEW TitaniumAutoGyro . Neil Sheather's 6 year dream & hard work- scientific development ....of a rugged "Euro-type" new-gen gyro ... with ultra strong, non-corroding lightweight frame of titanium . Plus an extremely strong carbon composite body/tail .... about to make it's international debut!!!! ... coupled with a C-F rotor system that WILL NOT break ... or disintegrate as the extruded AL ones from Europe . have been known to do ... no cracking AL hub-bars ... . NO delaminating like the fiberglass ones..(. that rely ON LOTS OF GLUE) ...to unify the 2 halves. ... There is a spectacular picture of what happens to a GLUED FIBERGLASS rotor ... when a roo impacts the gyro on TO ... .... split in 1/2 longways!!! Neil's rotors ... made in Australia .....use carbon fiber - pre preg resin technique ... .. (absolutely not an inexpensive method) ... but an extremely strong & light rotor. ..... with lead tip weights ... give great rotor inertia .... the recent flight tests this week in OZ showed ... a little too much tip weight ... going back to rotor maker to be tweaked a bit to give the right combination of sporty flight & cruiser/ landing float rotor RPM's! ASK away ...... we are excited to be part of this new advanced gyro coming soon to  
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