Probably something like this?
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| Flying by the numbers http://skywolverines.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4556 |
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| Author: | elwood [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 7:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Flying by the numbers |
This is what happens when you teach someone to fly without teaching rotor management. |
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| Author: | JonCarleton [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Ouch! I wonder what happened next? |
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
JonCarleton wrote: Ouch! I wonder what happened next? I changed my shorts |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Nov 29, 2016 10:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Probably something like this?
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| Author: | Gabor [ Wed Nov 30, 2016 12:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
I didn't see anything wrong with dat! 
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Try this one then? Pushing the stick forward would have been a great idea  Sure de-values machines rather quickly....  People need to learn WHY gyros fly.... not simply do what the phucking manual tells them to do.... You notice this guy winds up the prerotator then slams the stick back and floors it.... but that is exactly what the manual says to do.... He did the typical thing FW pilots do.... try to climb with the stick... and in a gyro, that don't work.... like truing to start driving your car up a hill with the hand brake on... Oh well, one less tub... hopefully no one hurt  At least the manual will keep the manufacturer safe from prosecution.... |
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| Author: | Henry Bowman [ Wed Nov 30, 2016 9:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
On the other site Vance is questioning how come his students don't seem to understand his instructions about flying and take off and rotor management. A difficult spot to be in as a CFI. Some tried to tell him that they need to learn rotor management on more basic terms than just using the guages. I hope for their sake he figures it out. |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Wed Nov 30, 2016 9:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
I'm sorry, but every gyro pilot should learn in a basic Bensen side by side 2 seater with no prerotator... When they can get the rotors up to flying speed, then they can start their training there, I said it... whew! feel better now  35 kts lift off, 35 kts climb, 35 kts cruise, 35 kts approach about 2 kts touchdown And people couldn't wait to go for a fly in one... Today, no one would want to be seen dead in one so basic? They would rather be seen dead in something way more trendy looking (literally)  
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| Author: | Gabor [ Wed Nov 30, 2016 12:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Henry Bowman wrote: On the other site Vance is questioning how come his students don't seem to understand his instructions about flying and take off and rotor management. A difficult spot to be in as a CFI. Some tried to tell him that they need to learn rotor management on more basic terms than just using the guages. I hope for their sake he figures it out. Bright minds can NOT always communicate well. They don't know how to do basic.....kind of kindergarten level. Due to my language difficulties I always made sure we all had learned on the kindergarten level.... When I don't want ya'll understand I just speak like this: Íöüáéterueö99twéálkáűjéke |
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| Author: | Henry Bowman [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 2:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
That has always been one of my issues with his being a CFI. I would not do well with his style or checlists for every minutia. |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 7:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Gabor wrote: .....Bright minds can NOT always communicate well. Íöüáéterueö99twéálkáűjéke Hey, that must be why I cant understand a word you say? And why you cant understand a word I say?  Must be because we are to darn bright? 
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| Author: | elwood [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
MadMuz wrote: Gabor wrote: .....Bright minds can NOT always communicate well. Íöüáéterueö99twéálkáűjéke Hey, that must be why I cant understand a word you say? And why you cant understand a word I say? Must be because we are to darn bright? Yeah! That's it! 
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| Author: | Gabor [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
But we at least know that when one of us stops emitting vocal resonation we both have to chuckle.....we are intelligent that way.....
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| Author: | elwood [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
yeah that long distance delay thing really makes it tough... |
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| Author: | Gabor [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 8:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Between our accents we need a freaking interpreter ......
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| Author: | Hillberg [ Thu Dec 01, 2016 3:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
I'm neon! toes! toes! toe porn! |
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| Author: | Mceagle [ Sat Dec 03, 2016 3:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
MadMuz wrote: I'm sorry, but every gyro pilot should learn in a basic Bensen side by side 2 seater with no prerotator... When they can get the rotors up to flying speed, then they can start their training Muz's top photo is Rosco's two seat trainer. The first standard EA81 powered 2 seater in Australia - possible the world, at a time when many were having trouble making a single seater EA81 fly. Rosco has carried a 200 lb student in this machine, and Rosco himself is not light. |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Sat Dec 03, 2016 6:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
The redrive and monster prop was the key  Those things taught many people to fly.... and Joe Pecketts machine.... just basic, open machines but once you learned to fly in one of those, you had a good understanding of HOW they work.... them woz the days. That was the ASRA nationals at Forbes in 1995 Tim....  Hope you are enjoying the storm Tim.... mega lightning here at the moment 
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| Author: | Mceagle [ Tue Dec 06, 2016 3:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
Yes Muz, the reduction drive, 76" warp, 27' McCutcheons and minimum weight all were the secret. This photo from Muz reminded me of something interesting. When building this gyro Ross decided to add a ground handling bar in front of the instrument panel. To serve a double purpose we decided to make it a dual drift indicator as well. We strapped two average size people in the seat and measured between their noses, so the string on their side would point straight back at their face in proper coordinated flight. Then mounted two 6" wires up at this distance and tied a string to each one - couldn't be simpler! We were quite surprised to observe that both strings angled approx 15° to 20° outwards away from the centre, and kicking a bit of rudder in made one string straight while the other got worse, and the gyro was flying crossed up. We eventually worked out that the incoming air was starting to flow outwards to pass around the two bodies, well ahead of them and even ahead of the drift strings. A few mods tried didn't help. The student simply had to get used to the string angle that Ross told them was correct for "straight" flight. |
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| Author: | Gabor [ Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Flying by the numbers |
That is a very interesting experiment Tim. It does perfectly exemplify the impact of the airflow around the body in an open frame and just how much it can change the behavior of the machine rather dramatically. What I found is that the weight of the pilot or passenger is less of a factor than the size of them. A tall guy like my gyro CFI was had so much more drag effect on the same gyro than let's say Lofty.....  But it's true. The same MTO with him sticking out (probably 6.4" around 190 cm but only 180 lbs) I had a hell of a time to take off on the short runway. And even when he had the control he couldn't get to more than 300 feet before we turned from upwind. I understand the minor differences between the same machines but this is significant performance change and Lofty still had the original setup back then. Prop the same , engine the same and all. Watch the difference between this with the tall guy and this with the not so tall guy Lofty take off around 3 minute mark |
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