I email Ron Heron (The Little Wing designer) asking the question I asked Vance basically what is the difference transitioning from being trained in a tricycle gear to a Little wing = tractor.

I basically fingered it out from observation looking at the blade angle of attack just sitting with tail wheel down but wanted to be sure. Ron's reply made it certain I do understand the difference and provided procedures:
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John,

Rotor management is different because the "fuselage deck-angle" of the rotor is different when the aircraft sits 'tail-down' (compared to a tri-gear pusher which sits level).

In other words, the rotor has a positive angle to the inflow, even with the stick forward. With the stick neutral, you have a rotor angle of ~18 degrees.....the same as when a Bensen tilts back onto its tailwheel. With the stick full-aft, you have ~ 9 degrees more positive angle than is possible in a tri-gear.

This allows very aggressive take-off and landing performance....but the management is critical. It is very easy to get into blade 'flap' if you don't fully understand how the autorotative rotor works. For example, you might be just fine pulling the stick full aft in a tri-gear pusher as you try to accelerate the blades. However, in the LW, it already sits at a 9-degree angle... so a neutral stick is the same as full-aft in a tri-gear pusher. If you pull the stick full aft before the rotor is 'ready' in the LW you will be guaranteed to get blade flap...and it may well whack the tail.

Once you get a mental visualization of all this, it starts to make sense and you can see how you can take advantage of the situation rather than let it cause you grief.

Using the forward stick lock is a must in the LW for ground maneuvering. It is very important as this will minimize the likelihood of inadvertent blade flap and it keeps the rotor at a maximum distance from the tail. By the way, this was standard procedure for all direct-control Autogiros from the 1930's and '40's. Using the rotor brake properly is important as well, since the rotor angle can't be reduced to zero (because the aircraft sits at ~ 9-degrees positive). In a wind, this can be problematic when trying to slow the rotor after landing.

It is almost a 'non-issue' once you have the concept down. I have never whacked a tail in all the years I have flown. But, it is because I have followed procedure for the aircraft configuration.

Good to hear from you John. Let me know if all this makes sense.

Ron

It is also important to recognize the ground-handling difference between pusher and tractor gyroplanes. Like fixed-wing aircraft, the CG of a tricycle gyroplane is in front of the main gear, while the CG is aft the main gear in a tractor. This makes the tractor configuration significantly more sensitive to ground yaw events. Should the tail be blown by a crosswind or mis-controlled in such a way that the CG moves outside the track of the main gear, very bad things will happen....namely ground loops and/or possible roll overs. This is not an issue with tricycle gear, as the main gear, following the CG, is pulled behind by the CG and forced to follow within the gear stance.

More care to prevent a ground loop must be taken in a tractor gyroplane than in a fixed-wing tail wheel aircraft. Fixed-wing aircraft have elevators, so it is possible to use airspeed and/or prop blast to force the tail wheel down to grip the surface by proper manipulation of the elevator.

One could force the tail down IF the rotors are up to speed with back cyclic, but if taxiing with the rotors stopped or slow, there is very little one can do to force the tail down and recover steerage should a gust pick it up or blow it sideways. The old, "climb into the wind, dive away from the wind," fixed-wing mantra only works because there is a working elevator on a fixed-wing tail. Using a burst of power and appropriate rudder might help, but it won't force the tail back down and could easily make matters worse for a tail already light.

You have to also be very careful with brake applications on a tractor tail dragger.... if the brakes are used too savagely at any speed, there is a great risk of standing it on its nose (bye bye prop and rotors) .... and unlike a TD airplane, the gyro doesn't have elevator to hold the tail down..... and like a tail dragger FW, the gyro tail dragger can be ground looped. I have seen some pics of tractor TD gyros with a skid behind the prop.... to make it hard for the prop to reach the ground ..... (good idea)

So tractor gyros need to be landed slowly and on 3 wheels and use the rotor for brakes until basically stopped ... then taxy slow.... Many have a steerable or locked tail wheel to stop ground looping....

I do like the idea of a tricycle tractor.... but personally have no desire to try tail dragger....

Are you looking at getting one John?

Hi Jon

You are so correct my friend and should have posted more about ground handling. I've flown many FW tail daggers so I knew and they do recommend taking training in FW tail daggers to learn ground handling a tractor gyro before you ever taxi a gyro.

With your permission I'll post this on PRA's web-site under training and RWF as I did with Ron's email to me? So as many people can learn about the differences as possible.
U-ROCK!!! Thank you.

John,

My opinions are free, and worth at least twice that much! Post as you see fit.

Yaw Mon!!
Most excellent point. With your permission I'll add it to the information I'm collecting.

I've wrote take-off and landing procedures and emailed them to Ron for audit and correction. Once I get them back I'll like to add both your and Jon's points so all can learn about them forever from PRA Training page on the subject. http://www.pra.org/default.aspx?p=TriGear2Tractor&i=83

PRA 31 has a Pittbull that we had donated to us. It's cost us $5,300 for me to fly to Anchorage Alaska rend a U-Haul and drive it 3,900 miles back through Alaska, Canada and the states to San Diego Ca.

We are fixing it up but it's already been converted to a tricycle gear. The only Pitbull I know of that is.

However one of our club members owns a Little Wing Dr. Bruce Charnov and he's not a pilot at all and has said I will fly it before he does so I'm trying to learn all I can before I transition into a tractor and fly it for him.

I did change part of your post as if you have a head wind the LW rotor brake will not stop the rotors until you turn downwind according to Ron.

"So tractor gyros need to be landed slowly and on 3 wheels then taxi slowly and you may have to taxi and turn downwind in order to let the rotor brake actually stop them if you have a strong head wind on landing. Many have a steerable or locked tail wheel to stop ground looping."

No worries.... I wouldn't credit me with the comments tho.... then no one would believe it was true....

That standing on the nose problem would have been why early tail draggers retained their elevators.... I don't know if you have seen any footage of early Ciervas and Pitcairns but they always land and take off from 3 wheels on and 3 point landings.... if the tail wheel of a tail dragger tractor gyro is ever off the ground.... the outlook is fairly bleak

I would also hazard a guess, crosswind takeoffs would be highly not recommended... Most of the footage of early tail draggers .... seems to be off big square paddocks, rather than directional strips with crosswinds....

Although, because of the amount of back rotor tilt, unless one is dong a downwind takeoff, or there is no wind at all... I doubt a Cierva style Autogiro would need much of a run.... and not at much speed....

I used to sit stationary facing into the wind for takeoff and because in those days you could get a foot to the ground and lift the nosewheel, you could get the nose wheel an extra 5-6" off the ground, giving more degrees of rotor tilt back.... it is amazing how much extra rotor rpm could be achieved by raising the front wheel..... I was actually working on a nosewheel with a lever pushing down on the spring seat (the tube bent forward with a fork coming back holding the wheel... a spring with a bolt up thru the fork, thru the spring, up thru the vertical part of the nosewheel pivot to another spring on the top and a nut.... There was a lever over the top of the nut, when the lever was pulled, it pushed down on the nut, pushing the top spring into compression which raised the front of the keel '''' because the nose wheel was only a short distance from the mains, an inch of top spring compression had the tail wheel on the ground.

Once you got the rotors over the hump (no prerotators back then) you could pull the lever to raise the front of the keel and in 15-20 kts of wind, almost take off with no run to speak of....

I will add a pic shortly... it is something I believe the tubs and dominator types where you cant touch the ground from the seat would benefit from.... but they (tubs) seem happy to take off and land at ridiculous speeds and fall over.... and I dare not suggest it, then they will do anything but try that

Edit: Shows you the basic idea. It got too heavy and in the end I just put a nosewheel brake on it, had the fork with 2 springs, one bottom and one top.... on a windy day, face into the wind, get the rotors to where they will go, put on the nosewheel brake, let the wind push the machine back with the nose brake on, which compressed the top spring and let the front of the keel raise up.... that was good enough