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| Fuel containers.. http://skywolverines.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2718 |
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| Author: | elwood [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | Fuel containers.. |
In case you have not noticed the Gov has F$%&d up all the new fuel containers, with stupid California idiot proof caps and spouts, and it takes 3 people to pour out of a new CARB compliant can....The gov couldn't pour piss out of a boot with instructions on the sole...but I digress.... Do not despair, I come bearing good news...You can buy a normal can, Motorsports fuel transfer container....very reasonably priced too I might add. http://www.vpracingfuels.com/containers Also cool colors! A color for Lofty to match his gyro! And one for Gabor! |
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| Author: | loftus [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 11:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Nice - I can even strap on a couple on the side and look like a far superior type gyro. Can't see if it says what volume they hold - are they 5 gal? |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
The top one matches annoying orange     Hey Lofty, the Titanium has 490# of thrust, what is your thrust on your buggy? I am just interested how much less a non turbo 912 makes? (thrust)   I am not trying to insult MTO's, it is simply purely out of interst 
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| Author: | elwood [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Yes 5 Gallon... |
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| Author: | loftus [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
MadMuz wrote: The top one matches annoying orange Hey Lofty, the Titanium has 490# of thrust, what is your thrust on your buggy? I am just interested how much less a non turbo 912 makes? (thrust) I am not trying to insult MTO's, it is simply purely out of interst I have no idea what the thrust measures on my gyro. Yeah I would expect it to be maybe 15% less, to account for the 15HP difference. On the other hand some say that the only way to take advantage of the Turbo fully is with an adjustable pitch prop, and that with a fixed pitch prop set for best overall performance one does not get more than 105 - 108 HP. From what I've read, there's not going to be much difference between the Bolly, Sensenich, DUC and maybe even Warp Drive. Craig MacPherson has a DUC on his upgraded 912 conversion (114 HP) and he is pretty happy as well. Looks like they have that Far Superior Gyro very nicely set up. I seem to have the Sensenich set up at the sweet spot right now, pulling 5400RPM on climb out and 5800 max straight and level. One up, and I weigh 145lbs, at sea level, I climb out over 1200fpm. With Gabor we climb out at about 450 - 500fpm. Larry has the Sensenich set up even sweeter, and I think the smoother airflow of the Calidus helps with that. Sensenich is also very quiet, and is the sweetest looking of them all, just wish it came in Orange.
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| Author: | Gabor [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Easy to figure out the thrust. You rope me behind the damn thing and if you can cause carpet burn on my ass it has at least 232 lbs thrust. Fick scientific figures!    
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
I think an orange prop on annoying orange would be too much.... I like it how it is now  I prefer a turbo to be boosting from about 1/4 throttle and I like draw thru turbo with a carb, from what I have been told, a 914 at anything less than 90% throttle is just a 912 and the turbo doesn't even compensate for altitude.... in the last 10% of throttle, the waste gate closes and you have 3-5 minutes of turbo panic power. I believe a 914 is at a disadvantage because most of the time it is carrying the dead weight of a turbo that is doing nothing. I set mine up so at wot it might touch 10 psi boost, at cruise, it is about 6 psi.... which compensates for altitude and allows you to back off in the cruise and still be making power. I have never liked blow thru turbos, I especially don't like the rotax waste gate system. For me, I reckon rather than carry all the extra weight of a turbo doing phuck all, I would rather have the 100Hp 912 and a little bottle of nitrous Edit: No way Gabs, you might pull the back of the keel off 
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| Author: | loftus [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
MadMuz wrote: :laughing I think an orange prop on annoying orange would be too much.... I like it how it is now I prefer a turbo to be boosting from about 1/4 throttle and I like draw thru turbo with a carb, from what I have been told, a 914 at anything less than 90% throttle is just a 912 and the turbo doesn't even compensate for altitude.... in the last 10% of throttle, the waste gate closes and you have 3-5 minutes of turbo panic power. I believe a 914 is at a disadvantage because most of the time it is carrying the dead weight of a turbo that is doing nothing. I set mine up so at wot it might touch 10 psi boost, at cruise, it is about 6 psi.... which compensates for altitude and allows you to back off in the cruise and still be making power. I have never liked blow thru turbos, I especially don't like the rotax waste gate system. For me, I reckon rather than carry all the extra weight of a turbo doing phuck all, I would rather have the 100Hp 912 and a little bottle of nitrous Edit: No way Gabs, you might pull the back of the keel off As I plan for floats, I have to think about how I want to do a power upgrade. The 912 upgrade to 114HP that Ronnie Smith in Mississippi does seems to work great, and Craig McPherson who flogs the hell out of his machine is very happy and has found it to be reliable. Victor Agadzi has done a 135HP upgrade of his 914 with them, is happy with it so far. so I am looking at my options. Another option is sell my MTO and do another MTO with the 135HP Weber or go the Far Superior route. Cheapest will be the 114HP upgrade for about $5K. I think with my weight that should be OK. |
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| Author: | elwood [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Gabor wrote: Easy to figure out the thrust. You rope me behind the damn thing and if you can cause carpet burn on my ass it has at least 232 lbs thrust. Fick scientific figures! That is awesome! That Quote will go down in the annals of Aviation history right there. |
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| Author: | loftus [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
While we are on the Turbo 914 discussion, are the altitude benefits of the 914 also only limited to 5 minutes, or is that constant at cruise? |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Well, as far as I have been told by owners, the wastegate is open until the last 10% of throttle, then the wastegate closes and you can use the max power for no more than 5 minutes.... so to me, that means there is no boost until full throttle? If someone who flies a 914 is reading this, what does the boost gage read at cruise? Any boost at all?  Edit: You have to remember, the 9 series 4 stroke rotaxes only have a 2 stroke, pressed together crank.... they don't have rods and bearings like a car.... they are not designed to last under full on conditions and the turbo obviously knocks them around to have to have limited full power
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| Author: | Gabor [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
elwood wrote: Gabor wrote: Easy to figure out the thrust. You rope me behind the damn thing and if you can cause carpet burn on my ass it has at least 232 lbs thrust. Fick scientific figures! That is awesome! That Quote will go down in the annals of Aviation history right there. Just keeping it practical............
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| Author: | Gabor [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
The Yamaha puts out 150 HP. With Teal's plate using the C box it is a bulletproof unbeatable no fiddle no risk solution...... |
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
That's right, unless there is some awful harmonics or other issues, the Yamaha, Honda, Nissan, Suzuki, Toyota, Kia, Proton, Mitsubishi etc.... engines should be better than a rotax.... If someone could come up with a gearbox and adapter that was reliable and didn't cost stupid money..... we can go to a wrecker and buy any engine from any crashed rear end car for $500 and slap a reduction drive on it and go flying Then everyone will tell rotax to go phuck themselves and they will have to reduce the prices to something less stupid
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
And what people seem to fail to remember, is that yes, the redline on the tacho reads 10,000rpm so theoretically, that must be where the power is, so I will want the prop to do 2400 rpm so that's easy, I need a reduction of 4.16-1 and I can happily fly all day, being deafened by a motor right behind my head doing 9000 rpm   Wrong..... you look at the stock power graph and see where the torque levels off and the Hp starts to stop climbing and find that rpm, say 8200 rpm.... that is where you want full throttle to take you, then you look at where the torque levels off.... a bit below that is where you want cruise to be, say 7000rpm.... so the reduction you really want is about 3.1-1 (or less) and you can fly everywhere with the motor making bulk power at takeoff, and at cruise, the motor is at a pleasant 6500-7000 rpm.... so prop, motor and pilots ears are all in their happy place and no tinnitis (ringing ears)
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| Author: | Gabor [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 3:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Now Muz l know you know better than that. 11500 red line on the tach is only 8300 on the Yamaha due to the built in reduction that allows the half ton side load on the stub. If you didn't. .... Well you are welcome 
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| Author: | Ronin [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
I have run a 914 for more than 10 minutes wide open. At least on the older ones if the T&P's stay in the green it wouldn't pull/cut boost. The 914 is always in "boost" to some extent. At any given RPM it will show higher MP than a 912. **I had to dig up my old flight journals and double check those numbers** I used to run cross country at 5,000/5,200rpm and 29/31 or so inches depending on altitude. And I did a LOT of cross country in them. Ivan Shaw the Europa designer used to run the Sun 60 race wide open the whole time at sea level. I've had a 914 Europa to 22.5k and a friend that used to work for Kodiak research took a 914 Kitfox to 29k once. He said it never over heated but did boil all the coolant out of it. Said it took him over half an hour to get it down again deadstick! |
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| Author: | gyromike [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Here's how I fixed my fuel spout issues: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DGVRXD2?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00  Need extra venting? Pack of 10 vents. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MNC6L24?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00 
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| Author: | MadMuz [ Tue Jun 16, 2015 11:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
Gabor wrote: Now Muz l know you know better than that. 11500 red line on the tach is only 8300 on the Yamaha due to the built in reduction that allows the half ton side load on the stub. If you didn't. .... Well you are welcome I wasn't actually referring to the Yamaha engine Gabs, just engines in general. Some makes of engine don't have the geared output shaft, some are 1 turn of the crank to one turn of the output shaft, just general engines I have seen used. Do any of the other engines like Honda, Suzuki, Hyundai etc have the geared output shaft? Back on the topic of the fuel containers....If I saw a lady walking along with one of those gas bottles in each hand, I would definitely say "Nice pair of jugs you have there lady! They are a very nice shape, not too big and not too small.... they look smooth, well rounded and firm....and they don't bounce too much when you walk either and no sign of any leakage..... I wouldn't mind touching them and holding them if that's ok?" If she says no.... I would just say "No worries.... I like your gas containers as well"
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| Author: | Gabor [ Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fuel containers.. |
`To the best of my knowledge (that is not much to go on) Yamaha is the only one. The reasoning was the clutch on the snowmobile had so much side loading on the crank that they either had to soften the grip or simply slow the speed and use the reduction as a side loading elimination device at the same time. As a matter of fact Ernie had his first Yammie with an output geared directly from the crank gear replacing the reduction output stub with a 4:1 ratio spinning his prop at around 2400. He told me not to do that. The engine has some serious torque even at very slow speed that will shake the damn thing violently if the prop is directly attached to it. Anyways. That's where my "knowledge" ends......I told ya....
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