Thank you so much! She was soooooo excited and totally blown away. She has just found her new "thing"
She took video of the landing and telling everyone to check you guys out. She posted your website.
Chicks are easy targets LOL.

On the Cammie canyon subject I did a test flight that at 85 knots level flight produced only small altitude gains with power to idle. And that was posted on that thread. Back to the new MTO. I met with the new used car Salesmen Andy and he seemed very annoyed that I found yet another bad build they produced last fall. Even after showing exactly why whith the machine in front of him and an A and P present he was full of excuses but agreed it was wrong. However tried to say it was just this one. I am sorry after fixing more then 18 of them I just do not know what to say. It's good to see they are taking some things a little more serious.
But still act like they can do no wrong. I must just be an abrasive thorn in there side that is not afraid to stand my ground when I see bad building.

Desmon you had more close contact with the machines than the average enthusiasts.
Most don't ever get below the covers so to speak.
When a company becomes arrogant they usually don't do too well long term.
Patrons will become more and more frustrated being told that it's them what's wrong with the machine.
Heard many times the prop delamination and pre-rotator bracket cracking to teeter bolt problems and on and on.
Somehow the first reaction used to be that it was either incorrectly assembled or operated.
I hope that changes. When you cough up 60-70 Gs for something like a gyro you kind of have some expectations. But then again....what do I know?
It used to be that we had "idiots" here in the U.S. and they didn't know what they were doing and on and on.....til the same problems started showing up in Europe too.
I too hope the new line of machines will do better and the company will address the problems more promptly.
Competition is good. Forces one's hand to deal with issues or someone else will!
Again it's not knocking Autogyro GMBH it's just an observation.

Yeah, that's what I heard

Aaaaaand... good onya for it

How are the Titaniums going? How many in north America now?

Making Titaniums Far Superior again....

At sun n fun, the literature for the mto sport boasted a 68 foot takeoff with a rotax 914. I wanna see that demonstrated. I have my doubts. That was at 2000 msl with ten gallons of gasoline, if I remember correctly.

No one wants those Australian junkers here! the rotors turn the wrong way!

Just kidding, I saw Danny Kelly's at Bensen Days, He brought some fish for the fish fry in it,

That is perfectly achievable in any gyro... if you have a 25kt headwind and a pilot who knows rotor handling... with enough wind and a proficient pilot, you can take off with zero roll. I always used to enjoy tying my gyro to a parked car with a ski rope and kite in the wind without the motor running ..... just needed more than about 15kts of steady wind.... could hang around for ages

I would like to see it in zero wind tho

Yeah; I would take these numbers with a grain of salt. Autogyro has apparently not yet even completed the POH on this aircraft.
I sure hope they don't emphasize perorating to top RRPM and aggressive takeoffs as a routine thing, or we're gonna see a lot of torn up pre rotators at least and some torn up gyros. Again, talking to the Autogyro folks, they did emphasize that they anticipate additional training with this gyro probably to master these more aggressive peroration takeoffs. Autogyro has put a lot of emphasis the last couple of years on their training syllabus using the books etc by Phil Harwood. I know not every one agrees exactly with his approach, but I think he has done an excellent job. http://www.gyrocopterexperience.com/about-us

The trouble with any ' for payment' teaching of any of the modern clones, is that the school will likely want you to buy one of their machines... of the brand they profit from selling...

and as I keep endlessly moaning about.... they will only teach you how to fly around the shortcomings of that particular machine.... not how to actually fly a gyrocopter, and generally not how to properly handle rotors. The manufacturer copies the copy they choose to copy.... built by someone who doesn't really know how they work.... so they copy this, find it has issues, then have to write a manual to skirt around the machines flaws.

I will say, until they nail me in a box, people should learn to fly in a basic, open side by side stick machine with no prerotator. They should learn to fly this machine, then change over to a euro clone. Our early 2 seaters could do 40 mph. They took off at 35mph... climb 40 mph, cruise 40 mph, approach at 40mph and land at walking pace. Students learned HOW to fly.... not just " do this and it will fly"

I remember seeing a video of an instructor teaching a student to fly a tub... the student did a fairly good powered landing, but not a swoop and plop that I call a gyro landing.... and on the 3rd attempt, when the student landed at 45mph or something, a perfect Cessna landing, he got a big pat on the back and job well done?

How can people learn to fly a gyro when they are being taught to fly a Cessna... in a gyro?

The whole system is wrong.... Over here now, if a person wants to learn, if they go to a tub instructor, they can only get a license to fly a tub... if they have a tub license, they cant just go and climb into the nearest open frame machine. They would have to learn to fly a gyrocopter to do that...

However, if someone can proficiently fly a stick machine, I would say it would take 10 minutes to be able to fly a tub.....

The clone gyroplanes have ruined gyrocopters.

People who fly FA18' s didn't learn to fly in a FA18.... they prolly started in a Cessna, bigger Cessna, Twin, turbo prop, then jets..... progression. IMO, gyro pilots should learn in a open 2 seater, then get a single place, then get a tub or cavalon or whatever....

If you have a daughter and she has a boy come to pick her up.... on his motorbike..... would you rather the 450 kilogram, road tourer (gold wing/Hayabusa/Harley) with full fairing, paniers, trailer was his first motorcycle he got 2 weeks ago.... or his 5th motorcycle because he has been riding for 15 years?

I think it would be safer if someone had started learning on a pee wee 50, then got an 80cc, then a 125cc, then 250cc, then a 250cc road bike, then a 600, then a 1000.... they will know HOW to ride. Someone who has never ridden a motorcycle goes and buys a sports 1200cc bike and gets lessons to learn to ride it....he would have trouble getting onto a 250 dirt bike because they only know how to ride the huge road tourer...

Some progressional learning is much better than just learning to fly the fighter jet with no previous flight experience.... sure, someone with no flight experience COULD be taught how to fly a 747.... but airline pilots have to learn progressively.... well, imo, so should gyro pilots

The pic is one of our 2 seat side by side machines. It started out as an air command and got a 912 and so on....

I always wondered how well a SxS machine flys compared to a tandem open machine.

Compared to a tandem machine, a side by side is very slow.... pretty well useless.... but great for training because if a student freezes or panics, the instructor can elbow some sense into the student...

Tim will have lots of pics of side by side machines used for training... just don't ask him about the one with the gu.n mounted on it (M60 according to the legend) and the unexpected landing after the brass went thru the prop.... that is top secret

Unless someone only wants to fly at 55-60 mph everywhere, a 2 seat side by side is awful.... but as a pure trainer, absolutely brilliant. I built a frame once for a guy similar to the one I bought back... except I staggered the seats so the left seat was slightly ahead of the right seat which made the machine 5" narrower. That is the biggest issue, the drag profile is huge with 2 people, and when one up, alot of rudder needed to fly straight

I like them as a trainer tho, cheap... no nonsense, no clearance issues... great trainers

Hopefully Tim can post some pics

It makes sense Muz that the wide body is a lot of drag.
Makes me wonder how efficient a pusher configuration is with a sxs seating.
I mean unless you have a big ass prop that can overcome the 05-60-or even 70% airflow blockage by the two seats in front of it....????
Has anyone flown the Xenon or Trendak ?
That thing has a huge body.....

This might be an ideal, but completely unrealistic. Where are these cheap side-by-side machines with no pre rotators supposed to come from. I have actually never seen one in the 6 years or so I've been in gyros. In reality the standard 'trainers' are really the tandem eurogyros like the MTO, the AR-1, Titanium etc. In the modern gyro world, these are the only real options for anyone wanting to learn gyros, unless one wants to be a builder. Most people, really don't want to build gyros, they want to be able to rent and learn and fly in standard machines, just like most FW people want to be able to rent, and learn, and fly a 152. Desmon wrote a thread a few years ago about how the MTO was the Cessna 152 of gyros. Muz you are not wrong, just unrealistic, the world you wish for simply does not exist anymore. Eurogyros may have killed that, but if it were not for the euro clone thing, there would only be a few old guys flying homebuilts left. The sport of gyros and aviation in general has been a dying sport with very little new blood entering the arena, Euroclones have at least temporarily pushed back against that. You have a point about how folks are being taught to fly a gyro like a Cessna, but that's not the gyro's fault. I think the answer is somewhere in the middle, instruction should incorporate old school ideas, but also be realistic and teach some of the realities of flying gyros in FW airports etc, where they are flown most these days. That's why I like Des's style of teaching, not forgetting to teach the basics of rotor handling etc, but also teaching certain disciplines more in line with FW flying.

I cannot say that I disagree with Lofty, He is right the culture is changing, Everyone at Bensen Days that was asking questions as a newbie all wanted to know how much $$ bla bla bla, when I mentioned "available as a kit"
the response was "I don't want to build",
Me personally, I am getting tired of building all the time, don't get me wrong, but If I had a nice 2 place something or another to fly with the wife.......I mean shoooot I live in a hangar with a runway out front...
I need to get something that we can fly around in together with out breaking the bank, and before I am too old..

Jeff- I agree with your post. My only extra emphasis would be on power off landings all the time.......Engine outs are much rarer now with the 4 stroke Rotaxes....but for the pilots that are engrained to land fast...when they do have a real engine out in the boonies, that's why a much higher percentage get tipped over and trashed. Had I been trained to land at 20 mph or whatever speed I witness happening too many landing at, had I trained myself to land fast, I would bet my home that out of my 18 forced gyro landings , I would have trashed my gyro several times, instead on not so much a scratch. ...probably would have injured myself a few times also.

All gyros, tubs, single, tandems, should have the pilot automatically have muscle memory and mental recalling to bring that gyro to a halt.

I never will forget being asked why I land my gyros, especially my RAF 2000 and my SparrowHawk, with power off and a steeper flare...setting the tail wheel down first. I guess I didn't know what I was doing as it was known I never had one minute of gyro training.

That is what I like about flying with Jon, and Greg, they fly them just like old school gyro guys, (me)

I also agree with Lofty, the clones have taken over for the most part... because the rules are now designed around euro tubs, almost to the point where an open frame home built becomes illegal.

What is happening to gyros has also happened with cars.... the new cars have their faults... alot of the faults are programmed in, to bring the cars owner to the dealer because the check engine/bend over light suddenly started flashing.... so you have to go to the dealer and spend another $3K to get the next 20,000 miles of trouble free driving.

In fact, cars and gyros are on a very similar path. Where cars were more agricultural, with a clutch pedal, and where one had to learn to drive it properly to get the best out of it.... if it began to skid on a corner or wet road, the driver had to learn how to correct it.... now, the computer does most of it, the yaw control diff and anti lock brakes can help avoid needing to learn how to drive a car... If the driver, or 'steerer' has no skill and the cars technology cant prevent the accident... oh well, the airbags should save you.... and the insurance will see you driving a new car in a day or 2. Now, it is not unusual to hear of a police chase where the driver is a 13 year old kid that has only ever driven on a playstation. In the old days, if you could drive a stick shift car, you had to learn to do it... now, if you can buy a stick , it will be an auto with a manual shift lever to resemble a stick.... or a twin clutch with launch control.... and a stick like of flappy paddle shifters.... All of this technology is awesome.... when it works... if it gets a glitch... well, get your wallet out and bend over.

I started flying gyros by avoiding most airports and flying off farms and backwater airstrips.... I am happy to just finish up doing the same. I am happy to do my thing and read about people landing tubs at 45mph and following the centerline of the runway only to be hit by the 'freak gust of wind' that claims so many modern machines. Or, that the 'pilot' lands the eurotubs like a Cessna and doesn't realise he is still doing 35mph as he turns off the airstrip onto the taxiway.... and gets hit by that 'freak gust of wind' again, and has to pay another $50K to rebuild it again....

I am happy to say "Each to their own" ..... spend big bux buying something shiny and airplane like so you can feel like a 'real pilot' ... but the trouble is, the new rules for gyrocopters are being made entirely with gyroplanes in mind making it hard for gyrocopters.....

You also have to remember that I don't have a car from this century (and wont have one unless forced) and my main car I drive is a 1963 model, the next most used is a 91 model.... and even tho the new rules are aimed at the modern car, driving the old ones (which is more fun imo) is still quite acceptable and we can get away with so many things you couldn't in a car from this century....

So, I will enjoy my old junk until they nail my box shut .... I will keep driving cars I can fix myself, even tho new cars are soon not going to have a hood release.... there will be nothing under the hood that the owner can do... some already have no dip sticks for motor or trans, no alternator adjustments.... cant get the spark plugs out because the induction has to come off to get in there.... yuck... not for me

Something I have been meaning to ask about the clones.... if someone has a 2003 ELA.... can they buy a new frame for it for its TBO at 1500 hours? Or does the machine just get welded where it has cracked? Like, are parts available for a 2005 autogyro? Or are you on your own and have to make your own parts or upgrade to a newer frame?

I cannot disagree with that either.....I liked my old simple cars, but driving 500 miles a week just took a toll on them, and ME, I like my A/C and cruise control, and a comfy seat that does not hurt my back....
My newest car is a 2002 so it is not new by any means..
I like kick start motorcycles too, but the electric leg is so much easier on the knees!

Never thought I would like a motorcycle with a windshield, and floor boards, and bags ( I was always a stripped down chopper guy...) .till I got one, I liked it very much, the windshield kept the bugs off me, and kept wind fatigue down, I could move my feet and get comfy, or just move them to a different position, and with the bags, I could actually stop by the grocery store and get some groceries on the way home...

Have to admit, the older I get, the more I like my creature comforts. Hell since we installed that Toto butt washer/dryer toilet seat a few months ago, I can't wait to get home to it after a trip out of town.

I know it's all marketing and lipstick on a pig, but still a cool marketing video on the new MTO (Can't get it to show in the window here
https://youtu.be/mAP7g6-1hs8

Video