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 Alex Epstein - The Moral case for Fossil Fuels 
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Philosopher Alex Epstein champions fossil fuels at the Senate EPWC -- complete testimony and Q&A

Once in a while we get an intelligent person who can dismantle Global Warming in 15 minutes in a Senate speech.

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Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:54 pm
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Fuck Boxer.......


Fri Apr 15, 2016 5:59 pm
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He handled her pretty good.


Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:18 pm
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Hillberg wrote:
Fuck Boxer.......


What a BITCH... ugly too... I wouldn't touch her with Narnies doodle :laughing :puke If someone can teach me something good to know, I dont care if they are a scientist, a doctor, an officeworker, a street sweeper or a bum (or even Lofty?) :laughing :chainsaw .... if the information is true, it doesnt matter who gives it to you?

I like Epstiens attitude.... not bad for a philosopher :laughing However, fossil fuel is relatively inexpensive and available.... for now

It took billions of years to create the fossil fuel we have now.... it has only taken 120 years to burn about half of it :noidea

And the population of the world has gone from less than 1 billion in 1901.... to nearly 9 billion, if not already. The first half of the fossil oil usage was used up mainly by we Australians, Americans, and the Europeans.... of late, Asia... now China and India are starting to start wasting it like we used to... so, prolly in 50 years, the earth will have very little fossil oil left to give... so it will be no longer cheap and available :noidea

I think it is important to use fossil fuels as the reliable backup... but not treat them as the be all and end all... because end, it will... it must, eventually :noidea

My thoughts on the C02 thing, is this. If you take sand and melt it to make glass... you havent reduced the weight of the earth.

If you take iron and make steel, you havent reduced the weight of the earth.... if you take water and boil it, you havent reduced the weight of the earth.... however, if you take oil or coal out of the ground and burn it, you have taken a pound of oil/coal and turned it into a few ounces of gas... which has reduced the weight of the earth :eek

So, why is the weight/mass of the earth important? Well, the moon was always escaping from the earth at half an inch a year... now it is getting away at about 2" a year.... could that be because the earth is getting lighter? The earth being lighter in weight means that its gravity suffers a reduction.... as gravity is a result of the mass.... the moons mass aint changing, the earths is.... so the earths hold on the moon is slipping... and the moons gravity has increased on the earth by the amount of weight the earth has lost?

The moons gravity controls our tide heights and the tension of the crust of our earth.... the moon also is responsible for our stability and seasons... if the moon buggers off into space, which it will eventually anyway.... but if we rush it, the earth will be an uninhabitable place much sooner :badluck :drama :eek :pop :yoda2 :Wolvie

:Confederate

Edit: Also... where oil is taken from deep in the ground, something has to replace the space left in the cavety... that would generally be water.... so, we have taken trillions and trillions of barrels of oil out of the ground.... so that may have been replaced by trillions and trillions of barrels of water.... which means that that amount of water is no longer available for the cycle of rain/weather etc... we have all seen what happens to water when it mixes with oil like leaving a car oil drain tray out in the weather.... the water and the oil turn to that gunk.... we humans are phucking the earth big time :badluck

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Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:56 am
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Yeah Boxer is a self important bitty.

Here in a nut shell.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49Teja5YNCo

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Sat Apr 16, 2016 7:46 am
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Another bit of interesting history about cheap resources.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYqrFBm7qdA

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Sat Apr 16, 2016 7:47 am
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They were very interesting Scott... I never knew that about Rockerfeller :eek :noidea :half

On the fossil fuels tho... I cant help but think the oil might be there for a purpose? Maybe it is our planets balance? Maybe it is the insulation of the molten core to the crust?

I think of it like, if you have one of those oil filled column heaters... and you need the thimble of oil.... you can take a thimble of it, 10 thimbles full of it... a cup of oil... 2 cups of oil... and the heater still works... in fact, it works better..... well, it is hotter...

but, eventually, you will take enough oil out of it, that the element will overheat/burn out.... i the heaters case, it may just stop working... but in the earths case, the molten core might get closer to the crust.... restart dormant volcanos.... cause earthquakes and all the other nasties associated with volcanic activity? Who knows?

I just think in a few hundred years, those following us will be astonished at us for burning all of the oil.... they may laugh, but they will be shaking thier heads in disbelief :realcrazy :badluck

I reckon the answer is nuclear.... the world has had enough experience to make nuclear energy safely... as long as bom chuckas dont sabotage it. The issue is what to do with spent fuel rods... ok, so work out something to do with the spent fuel... to do some more spending with it... until there is nothing left of it... or, shoot them off into space....

But, yes, the fossil fuel era has made life better for most humans... but it is a finite amount of the substance that we have... as good as it is, we need to look at other things..... before it is too late :badluck :puke2

When ' the powers that be' do realise we have to stop using oil asap.... if it is not too late, it will have to stop immediately.... so all of the oil dependant machines will all be instantly obsolete. It wont prolly effect those living now, or thier children.... or the next few generations.... but when it comes to the crunch... those living then will know all about it :eek :badluck :killme :yoda2 :Wolvie

:Confederate

:yoda2

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Sun Apr 17, 2016 12:24 pm
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oil is a carbon based element- not dinosaurs or plants lots more mapped out then tapped. and it's more then just fuel it's vasoline!

nuclear fuel rods can be 'recharged' in a neutrino reactor it bombards the spent rods with radioactivity ,then reinstall in reactor and go and you can do it an unlimited amount of times U238 Viagra?


Sun Apr 17, 2016 1:29 pm
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Hillberg wrote:
oil is a carbon based element- not dinosaurs or plants lots more mapped out then tapped. and it's more then just fuel it's vasoline!



Yeah, I think from a barrel of oil, about 10% is gasoline, diesel or engine related oil... the rest is everything from terpintine, kerosene, soap, plastics, makeup, medications and so on... like they said in the rockerfeller video, he wanted to use every speck of the oil... and they do :laughing :yoda2 :Wolvie

:Confederate

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Sun Apr 17, 2016 1:35 pm
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I think that alternative fuels have their place, but we should not be forced backwards and mandated to use fuels that are more expensive, or really do not have a return on investment, Like Ethanol from corn, what a waste, it uses more energy than you get out of it..
Plus destroying the coal industry in the name of global warming is asinine.

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Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:28 pm
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turpentine is from baking trees in a kiln ageing lumber not oil. soaps are animal fats (pigs and cows) and lanoline is sheep oils


Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:38 pm
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Hillberg wrote:
Fuck Boxer.......


Isn't Boxer the bitch that dressed down a four star general for addressing her with a title of respect (Ma'am)?
She told him she "earned" the title senator and preferred him call her that.

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Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:58 pm
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RayNAiken wrote:
Hillberg wrote:
Fuck Boxer.......


Isn't Boxer the bitch that dressed down a four star general for addressing her with a title of respect (Ma'am)?
She told him she "earned" the title senator and preferred him call her that.


FUCK THAT COMMUNIST BITCH BOXER SHE'S SO FULL OF SHIT IT OZZES


Sun Apr 17, 2016 7:20 pm
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MadMuz wrote:
Hillberg wrote:
Fuck Boxer.......


What a BITCH... ugly too... I wouldn't touch her with Narnies doodle :laughing :puke If someone can teach me something good to know, I dont care if they are a scientist, a doctor, an officeworker, a street sweeper or a bum (or even Lofty?) :laughing :chainsaw .... if the information is true, it doesnt matter who gives it to you?

I like Epstiens attitude.... not bad for a philosopher :laughing However, fossil fuel is relatively inexpensive and available.... for now

It took billions of years to create the fossil fuel we have now.... it has only taken 120 years to burn about half of it :noidea

And the population of the world has gone from less than 1 billion in 1901.... to nearly 9 billion, if not already. The first half of the fossil oil usage was used up mainly by we Australians, Americans, and the Europeans.... of late, Asia... now China and India are starting to start wasting it like we used to... so, prolly in 50 years, the earth will have very little fossil oil left to give... so it will be no longer cheap and available :noidea

I think it is important to use fossil fuels as the reliable backup... but not treat them as the be all and end all... because end, it will... it must, eventually :noidea

My thoughts on the C02 thing, is this. If you take sand and melt it to make glass... you havent reduced the weight of the earth.

If you take iron and make steel, you havent reduced the weight of the earth.... if you take water and boil it, you havent reduced the weight of the earth.... however, if you take oil or coal out of the ground and burn it, you have taken a pound of oil/coal and turned it into a few ounces of gas... which has reduced the weight of the earth :eek

So, why is the weight/mass of the earth important? Well, the moon was always escaping from the earth at half an inch a year... now it is getting away at about 2" a year.... could that be because the earth is getting lighter? The earth being lighter in weight means that its gravity suffers a reduction.... as gravity is a result of the mass.... the moons mass aint changing, the earths is.... so the earths hold on the moon is slipping... and the moons gravity has increased on the earth by the amount of weight the earth has lost?

The moons gravity controls our tide heights and the tension of the crust of our earth.... the moon also is responsible for our stability and seasons... if the moon buggers off into space, which it will eventually anyway.... but if we rush it, the earth will be an uninhabitable place much sooner

Edit: Also... where oil is taken from deep in the ground, something has to replace the space left in the cavety... that would generally be water.... so, we have taken trillions and trillions of barrels of oil out of the ground.... so that may have been replaced by trillions and trillions of barrels of water.... which means that that amount of water is no longer available for the cycle of rain/weather etc... we have all seen what happens to water when it mixes with oil like leaving a car oil drain tray out in the weather.... the water and the oil turn to that gunk.... we humans are phucking the earth big time :badluck


I like your thinking Muz .... can I call you Einstein .... haaaa

Years ago I posed the question on a science type discussion ..... does the earth weigh more because there are 5 billion more people than there was in the early 1900's ..... the answer was no , the earth is mostly a closed system and only a few gases escape the atmosphere and go into space

Then it was mentioned there are tons of meteorite dust that land on earth all the time making it heavier .... but space ships and satellites in orbit make the world lighter .... so on and so forth ...... but I am like you , I think the world should weigh less because of all the oil we have burned

On the subject of underground oil ... there are a few theories that maybe oil keeps replenishing itself ...... some people point out that after all these years of pumping Saudi oil they have not run out yet.


Sun Apr 17, 2016 8:43 pm
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I have always understood that the earth does not get lighter at all by burning something whether it be wood or fossil fuels. Its mass is converted into gasses which stay in the atmosphere...then eventually come back down to earth. The solar wind may carry off a minute amount...but meteors add weight to the earth everyday.

The moon is ever so slowly pulling away from earth....but its because of the tidal bulge on opposite sides of the earth. The moon causes the tides , but they tidal bulges actually take a tiny bit of energy from the earths rotation as these bulges actually tug on the moon slightly accelerating it. Its an extremely small amount as I just Googled to find that it will slow the earths rotation 2 milliseconds every century. This is speeding the moon up slightly and this is what is causing it to pull away from earth slightly...like half an inch per year.

The talk of burning fossil fuels lightening the earth is just environmentalists scare tactics....like climate change.


Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:10 pm
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So if we burn a gallon of gasoline (weighs 6 pounds) .... does the exhaust coming out the pipe weigh 6 pounds ?


Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:37 pm
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That's what I read.


Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:41 pm
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Looked it up ..... burning 6 lbs of gas actually puts more than 6 lbs out the exhaust

https://epicenergyblog.com/2013/05/24/h ... e-produce/

Quote:
the carbon content of a gallon of gasoline is 5.3 pounds (2,400 grams). If each carbon atom in a gallon of gasoline becomes 3.6 times heavier when converted to carbon dioxide after combustion, then the 5.3 pounds of carbon in a gallon of gas becomes just over 19 pounds (8,650 grams) of carbon dioxide.

So the answer to the question posed at the beginning of this post is that after combustion, one gallon of gasoline weighing about 6 pounds, forms just over 19 pounds of carbon dioxide.

Put in perspective, when an 18 gallon tank is filled at the pump, that car leaves the gas station about 108 pounds heavier. Once that tank of gasoline has been consumed, that 100 pounds of gasoline has been converted into over 340 pounds of carbon dioxide and deposited into the atmosphere.


Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:45 pm
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Further to the article it says .....

Quote:
Gasoline is comprised primarily of carbon and hydrogen atoms linked together forming large carbon chain molecules. During the combustion process, the chemical bonds linking individual carbon atoms together are broken apart, releasing energy that is used to power the vehicle’s engine. When the bond between two carbon atoms is broken, each of those freed carbon atoms then bond naturally with other atoms in the atmosphere, typically oxygen atoms. From this chemical reaction we find the answer to our question.


https://epicenergyblog.com/2013/05/24/h ... e-produce/

I say fine .... but didnt those oxygen atoms already have weight before the carbon atoms attached to them ?

I failed high school science .... cant you tell .... haaaa


Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:56 pm
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Arnie- I looked it up also. 5.7 pounds of fuel makes 18. 2 pounds of co2....and also 8.2 pounds of water. It does this by burning 2O.5 pounds of oxygen. There are other smaller chemical reactions...but not only is the earth not getting lighter by burning a gallon of fuel...it is NOT getting heavier either.


Sun Apr 17, 2016 10:00 pm
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